Grandmaster chess legend on defending the free world from Putin

FRANK GAFFNEY: Welcome to Secure Freedom Radio. This is Frank Gaffney, your host and guide for what I think of as an intelligence briefing, on the war for the free world. A man who brings truly uncommon intelligence to such topics and who has been a great leader in the war for the free world for a very long time is Garry Kasparov. Best known of course, for his world class chess champion status for many years, but he also distinguished himself in a courageous manner as a Russian pro-democracy leader and a global human rights activist, as well as a speaker, an inspirational speaker at that, I might say, on many topics involving chess and freedom. Garry Kasparov is a dear friend of mine, we have not spoken in a frightfully long time, but I’m very pleased that the occasion of his new book, Winter is Coming: Why Vladimir Putin and the Enemies of the Free World Must Be Stopped, affords us an excuse to get together with him. Garry Kasparov, welcome back to Secure Freedom Radio, great to have you with us.

GARRY KASPAROV: Thanks for inviting me.

FRANK GAFFNEY: Well, the thesis of your new book, that there is in fact, a mortal threat to the free world, from Vladimir Putin, is one that I very much embrace, Garry. But maybe you could say a word about the status of the free world at the moment before you talk about the threats to it posed by Vladimir Putin.

GARRY KASPAROV: Well I actually emphasize that it’s not just Vladimir Putin, it’s Vladimir Putin and the enemies of the free world. He’s is the gang leader – the boss of bosses—because he is in a unique position as a Russian dictator, someone who controls an immensely powerful nuclear arsenal and military and security apparatus. He can defy the free world. He can defy the United States. He can defy Europe. And by doing so, he emboldens other thugs and dictators and terrorists –Iranian mullahs, North Korean dictators, and you name it. And as you correctly stated, the problem is not just the threat posed by these guys, but also the situation in the free world. And in my book, I try to explain what happened after the end of the Cold War, the collapse of the Berlin wall, the collapse of the Soviet Union, and it all seemed rosy. The very famous book by Francis Fukuyama named The End of History. Many of us share the same sentiment, you know, with the Soviet Union gone, what was the existential threat to the free world? But we were wrong, because evil doesn’t go away, it doesn’t disappear. It could be buried for a while under the rubble of the Berlin wall, but eventually it sprouts out. And the eight years of Bill Clinton administration were instrumental for the evil to regroup and strike back. It’s not accidental that during the unique moment in history where America could lead the world into a bright future by rebuilding world institutions and pursuing the freedom agenda, nobody wanted to, to be sort-of over aggressive. And one of the infamous deals cut with the Clinton Administration was a deal with North Korea in 1994. Few people remember it, you know, that basically preserved the worst dictatorial regime on this planet, and very few people remember that the first time when the Iranian nuclear issue was raised in negotiations with Russia, was in 1995. And it was Bill Clinton who decided to undermine the resolution—bipartisan resolution of the US Congress to tie the financial aid to Russia, which was crucial at that time, with the transfer of Russian nuclear controls to Iran.

FRANK GAFFNEY: This is really the rot that I think has been evident in, not just the West in general, but the United States government for some time as well. I think in fairness, some of this began under the George H.W. Bush administration as well, Garry Kasparov, because remember, they didn’t want to gloat about the Soviet Union being defeated and all that.

GARRY KASPAROV: Yeah, absolutely, I couldn’t agree more, and that’s why in my book, you know, I’m very critical of four administrations after Reagan. You correctly stated, you know, it all began with Bush ’41, who also could do a lot of things, you know, to smoothen this process of transition. But again, he had little time, maybe if you know, he would have won the elections in 1992, the world could be different. But I think it’s, Bill Clinton won, you know, because Americans didn’t want to hear about confrontation, they didn’t want to hear about conflicts, about problems with the world, everyone wanted to enjoy life.

FRANK GAFFNEY: Don’t worry be happy as they say. Hey Garry, let me just ask you about Putin before we run out of time. You described him as a Russian dictator, which of course he is, give us a flavor of what he’s doing to Russia at the moment. It’s been described as a cleptocracy. You have lived in it, you have confronted it, you have been threatened for doing so. What is Putin up to at the moment, and what must the free world do in response?

GARRY KASPAROV: Russia, when Putin took over, was a very fragile, you know, democracy, that you know, could be eventually turned into something plausible. Today, after sixteen years of Putin’s rule, it’s a full-blown one-man dictatorship. And, in Putin’s mind, Putin is Russia. So, Russia as a state, must serve his own interest, and he’s main interest now is political survival. And for him, political survival equals physical survival, because as a dictator he has so much blood on his hands, he has nowhere to go. So that’s why, as long as Putin stays in power, as long as Putin’s in the Kremlin, we could expect more and more conflicts provoked by Putin’s agents, cronies and Putin’s military. It’s Ukraine, Syria, and you know, if nothing changes, in the world climate, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Putin’s provocations even against a native countries like Estonia or Latvia. And what emboldens Putin is the weakness, indecisiveness of the free world. It’s the shameful policies of the Obama administration that have created a massive vacuum around the world. And this vacuum was filled of course by Putin’s Iranians, and other sects of terrorists. And every day that America is in retreat, it’s a day of the forces of evil, the enemies of the free world are in advance. And, many who thought that Syria was far away, but now with this, with a massive influx of refugees in Europe, they are threatening the very stability of the European Union, they are threatening the stability of Angela Merkel’s government in Germany, and she’s one of the sort of main opponents of Putin’s expansion in Europe.

FRANK GAFFNEY: Yeah. You know Garry, you are one of the great strategic thinkers of our time, of course. And I think your sense of the game that’s afoot here is [inaudible], as they say in France. But, in addition, you are a student of history, and what is so tragic about this is that with anybody with a lick of sense, let alone your skills, would have to understand that what we’re doing is we are creating unnecessary dangers. We are creating an environment in which we are likely to find ourselves, once again, embroiled in a horrific conflict, I’m afraid. Perhaps in Europe, certainly elsewhere around the world. What should we be doing to try to stave that off?

GARRY KASPAROV: As you pointed out, the lessons of history, it’s vital for us to learn from these lessons, not to repeat the same tragic mistakes we’ve made in the past. I know confronting Putin today would be dangerous, but doing nothing will create even more dangers tomorrow, because the price of delaying the response to a dictator, especially a powerful dictator, goes up every day. And something that is difficult today, tomorrow will be impossible, and will require even more drastic action. And for those who are saying Putin is so powerful, how can we confront him? Come on, Putin is not as powerful as Stalin in 1948 with Harry Truman [inaudible] Berlin, or the Soviet Union in 1980s when Ronald Reagan, you know, declared a crusade against Communism. It was far more powerful economically and militarily than Putin’s Russia today. It’s about political will, it’s about understanding that America has its role. Not to be the world’s policeman but to be a leader.

FRANK GAFFNEY: I couldn’t agree more. And Garry, we are hard out of time I’m afraid, I appreciate so much your analysis, your strategic vision, your courage in expressing all of this, and of course, your new book, Winter is Coming: Why Vladimir Putin and the Enemies of the Free World Need to be Stopped, I look forward to discussing this with you very often in 2016. Garry Kasparov, god bless you, keep it up.